Tuesday, December 8, 2015

Trump Calls for Complete Ban on Muslims Entering the United States



Recently, Presidential candidate Donald Trump said that he believes we should temporarily not allow any Muslims into the United States except those who are returning citizens (see links below).  He believes we are at war and that there is precedent for this type of measure.

Does anyone have any thoughts about this?  Do you think Trump is being too extreme?  Do you think such a measure is justifiable?

LINK 1

LINK 2



17 comments:

  1. If one were to take Jesus seriously, it would make sense to let them in. He taught his followers to "love your enemies and do good to those who persecute you". How is it "love" to keep your enemies and persecutors at arms length? How is it doing "good" to them who persecute you (as Muslims do to Christians specifically for their faith), and how is it turning the other cheek to the one who wants to smite it? What would Jesus do - would he keep the hated Samaritans (who in turn hated Jews) away or would he love them and treat them with kindness, even if they wished to harm him? He would love Muslims and others hated by the "establishment", welcome and extend his love to them, like he did to the Romans occupying Judea, tax-collectors, thieves and prostitutes. The Romans were no less brutal than ISIS, and perhaps more so, yet Jesus loved them. Believers shouldn't worry about their earthly lives - dying to be in heaven with Jesus is gain (Philippians 1:21).

    (sarcasm)

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  2. Good one Gene, but on a more serious note...

    Those are only my thoughts and I don't think there is any situations for the Muslim threat.

    First, we have freedom of religion, which is really important for you and for me. We can disagree on religion, but you won't hurt me and I wont hurt you. I like to see it like that "It's no help we are all on the same boat". We all try to figure things out, and sometimes, we arrive at different conclusion. Muslims arrive at the conclusion that the quran is inspired. Some are peaceful Muslims, nobody doubts that, but the problem lies with the book. This book is about hate and killing. www.thereligionofpeace.com (mostly Jews and Christians)

    Most Muslims mind their business go to pray at the set times and believe anybody should believe what they want. There are also those Muslims who are born Muslim and don't practice anything, I have no problem if Muslims believe I will go to hell and want to share their faith, just as Christians do. But that's where things get complicated. How can we figure out the real Muslims, those who follow the book and have a literal interpretation of it. Can we, reasonably speaking say if a Muslim is an extremist (one who really follow the book)? I think the answer is no. 99.9% of Muslims won't do anything, but that religion is rotten.

    Now, if you want to go that path, though, they will decide and remove our freedom. Hey, they will say, not only Muslims are extremist, look at those fundamentalist Christians who judge gays! And down the pipe your freedom will go.

    So basically, I don't agree with Donald's view, and we will have to live with an increase amount of killing. Notes that it would help better to have gun regulations. In Canada, at least I feel safe, knowing that not everybody can have a gun. But again, that won't change because lobbies are too strong and it's in your constitution.

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  3. I meant solution instead of situation

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  4. "we will have to live with an increase amount of killing"

    Jesus approves of this message:)

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  5. Hey there,

    I'm not a US citizen. I'm from Saudi Arabia and I am Muslim. I have family currently studying in the US and I've been following the US elections. As crazy as Trump is, I believe he just wants to propel the American economy and make it the strongest in the world. So in his view, he wants to clear the game field (USA) of anyone which might not be economically beneficial for him and will just be an added weight. So in his logic, he wants away with non-American Muslims and Mexicans because they are weighing him down with Third World Problems. The problem is, the rate of Islamophobia is quite high in the West. And Trump's slurs just add fuel to the fire. Trump himself is not Islamophobic. He will kiss the feet of the Saudi King in exchange for riches. It's just the image that he has. It's not a bad thing that people in America are having discussions of religion. The discussions are relevant. But Trump only cares about the US Dollar sign. Obama's image and appeal was very humanitarian. No one remembers Obama and says he was after money. He was after people and their issues. But Trump, he just wants money.

    I just think that in order to affect Trump, you need to talk money!

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    1. "The problem is, the rate of Islamophobia is quite high in the West. And Trump's slurs just add fuel to the fire. Trump himself is not Islamophobic."

      Afnan... the term "Islamophobia" when used by Muslims and the press usually means that non-Muslims' fears of Islam are not justified. However, I think that "Islamophobia" is very much justified, since virtually ALL acts of terrorism today are committed by Islamists, that is Muslims who take Islam and Koran seriously. We just had 129 people murdered by Islamists in cold blood in Paris and 14 in California. We had 9/11 attacks by citizens of your country, which killed over 3,000 Americans. That means that innocent people are liable to be murdered en mass by Islamists anywhere and at any time.

      So, I think being Islamophobic is completely justified by facts on the ground. Non-Muslims are not to blame for this. There have been other mass murders in history committed by non-Muslims in modern history, but it's primary Muslims who murder for the cause of their religion.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Islamist_terrorist_attacks

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    2. And it's quite alarming how many Muslims agree with terrorism even if they would not do the act themselves. If you believe in the Quran, then you are in a way or another encouraging bloodshed.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_attitudes_towards_terrorism

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_attitudes_towards_terrorism

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    3. (36 vs 64) 64% of Muslims in France believed it could never be justified, 19% believed it could be justified rarely, 10% sometimes, and 6% thought it could be justified often.
      (30 vs 70) 70% of Muslims in Britain believed it could never be justified, 9% believed it could be justified rarely, 12% sometimes, and 3% thought it could be justified often.
      (17 vs 83) 83% of Muslims in Germany believed it could never be justified, 6% believed it could be justified rarely, 6% sometimes, and 1% thought it could be justified often.
      (31 vs 69) 69% of Muslims in Spain believed it could never be justified, 9% believed it could be justified rarely, 10% sometimes, and 6% thought it could be justified often.
      In mainly Muslim countries:
      (55 vs 45) 45% of Muslims in Egypt believed it could never be justified, 25% believed it could be justified rarely, 20% sometimes, and 8% thought it could be justified often.
      (39 vs 61) 61% of Muslims in Turkey believed it could never be justified, 9% believed it could be justified rarely, 14% sometimes, and 3% thought it could be justified often.
      (57 vs 43) 43% of Muslims in Jordan believed it could never be justified, 28% believed it could be justified rarely, 24% sometimes, and 5% thought it could be justified often.
      (72 vs 28) 28% of Muslims in Nigeria believed it could never be justified, 23% believed it could be justified rarely, 38% sometimes, and 8% thought it could be justified often.
      (31 vs 69) 69% of Muslims in Pakistan believed it could never be justified, 8% believed it could be justified rarely, 7% sometimes, and 7% thought it could be justified often.
      (29 vs 71) 71% of Muslims in Indonesia believed it could never be justified, 18% believed it could be justified rarely, 8% sometimes, and 2% thought it could be justified often.

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    4. Sorry the question was : whether suicide bombing and other forms of violence against civilian targets to defend Islam could be justified,

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    5. Afnan,

      If you want to talk about money, talk about Saudi Arabia that has invested billions and billions of dollars funding terrorist networks and jihadism. If you want to talk about Islamaphobia, perhaps you'll want to mention that 15 of the hijackers responsible for 9/11 were from Saudi Arabia.

      Saudi Arabia is so sick and twisted, they kill people for leaving Islam! We should want this ideology coming into our country?

      My hope for you is that you leave (escape) Islam and that you come to know the G-d of Israel.

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    6. Hi, Peter, as you say, they kill people when they leave Islam. It's might be hard for us to understand, but in Saudi Arabia, there is barely anything else than Islam. People are Muslims, and it does not even come to their mind to challenge that. And probably you and me would be in the same situation if we would have been born there. It does not mean that everybody believe what's what they say they practice. A few generation later, when they move to USA, they may realize that Islam is not the way.

      Think about the propaganda that they have their, everything is about Islam and how "great" that religion is.

      In a way, Trump would do the same thing by forbidding any Muslims to enter USA.






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    7. "A few generation later, when they move to USA, they may realize that Islam is not the way."

      Remi, Muslims are not like Jews - Islam doesn't assimilate very well with surrounding culture. Islam is an ethno-religio-political entity. Many of the Muslim terrorists who attacked Paris and California were born in the West.

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    8. True, I don't disagree with that, but what can we do, decide that all Muslims are a possible treat and refuse all of them entry to USA? What would you do if you were the President?

      Maybe it's time to open our eyes and ban the whole book as "Hateful literature", but that would cause even more violence and more hate from them :(

      I see the problem of Israel with the Palestinians coming to the rest of the world.

      Can this be a problem without solution?

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    9. Remi,

      RE: "Can this be a problem without solution?"

      Solution is Moshiach.

      Until then, we're at war.

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    10. Hmmm... well again, let's just disagree. Your messiah is a god that replaced G-d. Your messiah was forced on anybody, just like the Muslims today. They sure take their idea somewhere!

      And you say "There is no help for him in G-d" O Israel, hope in the L-rd (not Jesus).

      By the way "Jesus was supposed to come back in the life of his disciples. Unless his word did not come to past...

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    11. Remi, Jews would say that the solution to this problem is G-d's intervention. And whoever the Jewish leader (a human being like you and I) that will be established by Him will be part of that solution (but certainly not THE solution).

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  6. Hi Afnan, do you think the Quran teach violence in any way for those who don't believe in allah like the Jews and Christians?

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