So this initiative to get the One Law Messianic leaders to get together to eat bagels and shmooze for the greater good, I think I've got a good name for it: The Kol Echad Initiative.
I was thinking this would be a good name for several reasons. The phrase hakahal chukah achat (the community of one law--Numbers 15:15 uses the term "kahal" (federated community) which has the root word kol (voice). One of the federal ideas in the term kahal is that every member of the covenant has a voice and all the voices should come together as a single, compound voice (kol echad).
I was also wondering if anyone out there is or knows a graphic designer who wouldn't mind volunteering his or her services to create some designs/artwork for use in publicizing the Kol Echad Initiative on this site and perhaps on facebook. It would be greatly appreciated.
Peter...
ReplyDeleteI think that whatever will help distinguish the Messianic Jewish community from the Hebrew Roots (One-Law/Two House) communities will be beneficial to both.
One glaring problem, of course, is the use of word "messianic" by the "independent messianics". When someone calls themselves that, they are automatically associated with being "Jewish" in the minds of many. This is something that One-Law/Two-House advocates may not want to project as it causes undue confusion. The One-Law/Two House community should probably unify under some unique name, not unlike some other more established sabbatarian groups, e.g. the Seventh Day Adventists.
A word about expectations: this initial meeting is not a panacea. The expectation should be to understand each other a little better. Rapport building. This is important. If nothing else, who doesn't enjoy a tasty bagel?
Delete(in other words, Gene, I think you're getting a little ahead)
"Gene, I think you're getting a little ahead"
DeleteWell, being forward-thinking is a good thing, right? However, would only inviting "One-Law/Two-House" leaders to the meet and leaving out the Jewish ones put a bit of a damper on the whole "Kol Echad" thing? (I realize, of course, that Dan Benzvi counts as "Jewish", but you know what I mean).
Who said anything about leaving out Jews? Show me where I said that. Because if it turns out that I've said "Jews not welcome" anywhere on this blog then I'll probably need to go on anti-seizure medication or anti-craziness medication.
Delete"Who said anything about leaving out Jews? Show me where I said that."
DeletePeter, I think that when you said "this initiative to get the One Law Messianic leaders to get together..." made an impression of leaving Messianic Jewish leaders out, since I don't know of many or any Jewish-born One-Law leaders (unless Dan counts as a One-Law leader, whom I fully endorse for the role as stated in my previous count). I could be wrong (wouldn't be the first time).
Gene,
ReplyDeleteAre you implying that I espouse the 2 house false doctrine?
Gene,
ReplyDeleteAre you implying that I espouse the 2 house false doctrine?
Dan, I know from experience that most One-Law leaders and advocates regard the "2 house false doctrine" as simply a "distraction", not something to be seriously confronted. Very few speak out against it, with you being a notable exception (being Jewish / Israeli probably has something to do with it).
DeleteThat said, I do commend Tim Hegg for writing a comprehensive paper called The Two House Theory: Three Fatal Flaws:
http://www.torahresource.com/EnglishArticles/Two%20House%20Fatal%20Errors.pdf
I would love to see Peter take on the above paper on one of his blog posts.
Gene,
ReplyDeleteyou are a gentleman and a scholar....What can I say....
There has always simply been one people, followers of God, some native born Jews, others born foreigners. All require grafting onto the Root of Jesse. Those who refuse to obey and produce fruit are cut off. Those who humbly obey are grafted on (Romans 2:27-29; 11:17-26; Galatians 3:6-9, 28-29; Ephesians 2:11-19).
ReplyDeleteIn view of Paul’s clear and explicit statements:
• that “Gentiles are co-heirs, members of the same body, and partners of the promise” (Ephesians 3:6);
• that Gentiles who used to be excluded from the citizenship of Israel and were foreigners…have been brought near by the blood of the Messiah…who made both groups one and tore down the dividing wall of hostility…and created in Himself one new man from the two…” (Ephesians 2:11-19);
• that “There is no Jew of Greek…” (Galatians 3:27-28)
I think the constant attempt to distinguish between Hebrew and Gentile disciples is:
• Not conducive to peaceful discussion of biblical themes
• Not in accordance with the fundamental tenet of “one-law” theology
• Contrary to the clear teachings of the Scriptures
• Designed to create an artificial hierarchy or an elitist mentality.
Cajun... I am curious - what's your take on the Two-House theology? A "fact", a "serious problem", or a "distraction"?
DeleteI do not want to pretend that I have delved deeply into "Two-House" theology. I've only done what I would consider surface study over the last month or so. Frankly I'd never heard of it before then.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I have taught history for many years and from that perspective alone I would have to say that my first impression of its idea that somehow the tribes were lost among the Gentiles and are somehow reawakening to their dormant identity is ridiculous. I have recently been doing a lot of study on the theological ramifications of the human gene project. I've done some work (on a hobby level mind you) on tracking the confluence of Y-DNA haplogroups and I have found no evidence to support the theory.
Further and more importantly, I feel it runs contrary to the natural reading of the text that over and over again asserts that our citizenship in heaven or our identity in Hashem's family does not and has never primarily been about our genetic material. Those who call on Hashem and obey Him are His. Those who rebel, regardless of their genetic makeup, are cut off.
I realize this presentation is overly simplistic and I welcome biblical correction.
Excuse me, but I forgot to say that "Two-House" smacks of "British Israelism", and entirely discredited hypothesis. But Quoheleth warned that there was nothing new under the sun, didn't he?
ReplyDeleteCajun, I think you have a good grasp on the Two-House stuff, including its glaring British Israelism origins.
ReplyDeleteThank you brother. I feel like it's almost reverse bigotry. Instead of the church replacing Israel (a wrong-headed notion if I ever heard of one) now Israel replaces the church!
DeleteTo me, if being a Jew, of the tribe of Benjamin etc. etc. was useless in Paul's mind, then why does it keep coming up among the faithful?
(Shakes head) We humans are an odd lot.
Guys,
ReplyDeleteLet's stay focused on the goal. Theorizing publicly about lost tribes is a fruitless endeavor. And G-d wants us to focus on that which unites us: Yeshua, His Son. I'd advice any Two Housers out there to keep the overall goal in mind: growing in Torah so that we can build loving communities and worship G-d together as one Body.
We've got a lot of work to do in the coming months after Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, we'll need to finish assembling the list of leaders and start thinking about the logistics of contacting them.
" since I don't know of many or any Jewish-born One-Law leaders "
ReplyDeleteRabbi Greg Hershberg of Beth Yeshua International, for starters, and I know he knows quite a few others.
Steve Berkson, is Jewish-born and One-Law.
Just two examples, but there are more.
Also please define two house theology.
DeleteI am leaning toward the idea having some truth in it, but I am not dogmatic about it. It is a non-issue.
As for bigoted, church replacing Israel, etc . . . I would hardly call Orthodox Jewish organizations such as United Israel, Kol Ha Tor, Brit-Am, etc. bigoted against Jews and teaching that the church replaces any portion of Israel.
That is just a bunch of fear-mongering tripe. I am 100% positive that Chasidic Rabbi Avraham Greenbaum, who is now trying to spread the word to accept gentiles who wish to practice Torah, as they might be Ephraim coming back as prophesied, is a racist replacement theologian.
It is non-salvific, and really should not divide people. Both sides of the argument have some good points. But to go into a frothing tizzy over the idea is ridiculous. Sure, a group of people used the idea maliciously. A large group of people used the name of the Messiah of Israel to kill millions of Jews. If someone uses something for nefarious purposes, it does not necessarily make that something nefarious.
One would think it would bolster Jews, knowing that they have people trying to learn His instructions, and are willing to put it all out there for their brother. But as I have seen from people like Gene, the matter is an issue of pride and fear. Do I blame them? No. I completely understand.
Perhaps the view of Gamliel (Acts 5) should be taken. Don't fight it. If it is not of God, it will die. If it is of God, you are finding yourself fighting against God.
Oh well. We all have our views. I have said mine, and will not debate anyone's. Just please try not to make so many blanket statements. Have a great day! :)
Thank you for sharing your views with us and for turning us on to some folks that, even if they may not turn out to be allies, may yet turn out to be friends (Mark 9:40; Luke 9:50).
DeleteI'm sorry if my understanding of Two-House is one-dimensional. As I said, I only heard of it a month ago and I'm willing to be instructed. My perception has been colored by several factors:
a) The theology seems to imply that unless you are from a Hebraic gene pool, you wouldn't be attracted to the House of Israel. That is implicitly racist, unless I miss my mark.
b)The theology strongly resembles British Israelism which IS explicitly racist.
c)In my studies of history I have found that ideas like it always seems to lead to at least race elitism.
d) Over the last decade I've been verbally attacked, chased off or given the cold shoulder by NUMEROUS "converted" Jews for the simple fact that I am a Gentile (though I can trace my family back to a nice respectable Jewish family).
e) We keep coming back to discussions of who is Jewish and who is not, and is either salvation or the experience of the Body different for Jews and Gentiles - a fundamental racial divide.
I am glad to hear of those who are willing to transcend this divide. I hope that we CAN get over it and come to the realization and hope that the only thing that matters is the heart.
Thank you for enlightening me brother King. I appreciate your contribution.
S. King... OK, I'll take you up on your claims.
ReplyDelete"Steve Berkson, is Jewish-born and One-Law. "
I found the following from the former Steve Berkson (from the so called "Community Of Truth Seekers":
"This is Steve Berkson. I wanted to take a moment to publicly clarify where I am spiritually so that I may put an end to the abundance of speculation and rumors out there, much of which is incorrect. It is true that over a year and a half ago I ceased to believe in the validity of the New Testament and the messiah it presents. This decision was reached after extensive research that included: scrutinization for the purpose of verification of all of the NT claims of fulfillments of what are claimed to be “messianic” prophesies from the OT; the canonization process; historical evidence and much more. The result of the study was that I was and still am convinced that the NT is not the “Word” of God and is not authoritative."
Does the above guy qualify as 'One Law'?
"Rabbi Greg Hershberg of Beth Yeshua International, for starters"
I have emailed Rabbi Greg Hershberg and I am awaiting his response.
If British Israelism Brit-Am website (britam.org) is "Orthodox" or "Jewish" then I am a ballerina.
Rabbi Steve Berkson’s teachings can be found at www.mtoi.org and on YouTube under MTOI Worldwide. All are free, and you will only know where he stands by listening to him. I am thankful for Abba drawing me to him as my Teacher.
DeleteHershberg is One Law, but not two house.
ReplyDeleteRegarding Berkson, He stopped teaching back in 2002ish, because he could not reconcile some things in the NT. He has since reconciled them, and is teaching again. He has a video on his site explaining this. Don't have the link right now.
If you have questions about Yair Dividy's orthodoxy, I am sure you can contact him.
All I am putting out there is the fact that two house is not necessarily bigoted, based in Christianity, or some form of replacement theology/supercessionism.
@Cajun: I see what you are saying, and that stuff turned/turns me off as well. That is why we can never have anything nice. Bad people do bad things with what is supposed to be good. lol
It does kind of boil down to pointless genealogies, which profit no one. But the line of thinking is as much a possibility as it is not. As long as no one is being dumb or unloving about issues, if it is anon-salvific issue and not a sin, have at it.
People are too quick to pull the trigger on "heresies" and dividing up the body over unprovable and subjective things. Reminds me of the churches that split because a drum set was introduced to worship music.
Anyways, I ramble . . .
Blessings to you, and everyone else here as well. I may not post much, but I read and learn new things (sometimes not in the way the writers expect either lol).
Keep up the fellowship, and Shalom to all my brothers!
--Steven
"Hershberg is One Law, but not two house."
DeleteWhere's proof? I find nothing on his congregational site that would even remotely indicate that he is "One-Law". Standard MJ stuff. My email to him is yet to be replied.
"If you have questions about Yair Dividy's orthodoxy".
Australian-born British-Israelism promoter Yair Davidy (not his real name) claims ancestry from Jews on mother's side and British ancestry to support his BI claims. He claims that he was born "technically Jewish... but brought up in an extremely assimilated atmosphere". This "Orthodox rabbi" knew no Hebrew, until he says he started to learn it in government-sponsored ulpan after he made his way to Israel. He has been making money of other gullible "British Israelites" for quite a while now.
I listen to his teachings. There are some on youtube. His position is that the law is for everyone. If you take it up or not is between you and God.
ReplyDeleteAs for Dividy, again, contact him. I am not going to debate you over his orthodoxy. If you question it, debate him. I die not know ones national origin decided orthodoxy. o_O He obviously was able to make aliyah, so by typical standards, he is a Jew. As for British-Israelism, perhaps he does teach that. I have not looked too much into his studies, as I am still busy trying to learn all I can about matters of faith and obedience. My plate is full. But even if he does, it reinforces my point that the two-house teaching is not necessarily Christian replacement/supercessionist theology. It is a held belief in some areas of Judaism as well.
Even if you dismiss him, there are others as I mentioned. Avraham Feld (and his partner Obadiah Abrahami), Avraham Greenbaum, and United Israel. I am sure google will help you find more.
"His position is that the law is for everyone. If you take it up or not is between you and God."
DeleteWhat does this suppose to mean? One-Law position specifically doesn't make Torah "optional" for Gentiles, or "between you and G-d". What you are describing is more like "Divine Invitation".
"my point that the two-house teaching is not necessarily Christian replacement/supercessionist theology"
First of all, you've been citing race-based British Israelism promoters as examples of Two-House teachings. I am not sure you want to go there. I am yet to see any evidence that the people you mention are Jews. When I start to look into their backgrounds as supposed Jews, everything falls apart.
Also, you a
"Also, you a" - that was another thought that I will leave as is for now:)
DeleteIt means what it says. He teaches there is one law. If you (as a believer, Jew or Gentile) obey, that that is between you and God.
ReplyDeleteAs for race based two house, we can go there if you wish. The idea is not feasible. For example, look at how much intermingling has been done just since the US has become a country. And that is is only 250 years. Now multiply that times 7 or 8, not to mention the intermingling that was done between entering the land and the exile. And again, not to mention the mixed multitude that came up out of Egypt. There is no possible way that it can be based on race.
That is what happens when you make an assumption, instead of doing your due diligence. I never said it was based on race, and neither do the people I have listed, including Mr. Davidy, that I know of.
But hey. Your mind is made up. Any form of two house is obviously racist Christian identity. You are entitled to that belief, even though I find that it does not match with reality.
Have a great day.
MR. King,
ReplyDeleteThe two-house false doctrine is based on the false premise that Gentiles who have a liking for Judaism must be descendants of the so-called "lost 10 tribes."
None of them has yet came forward to identify the tribe they belong to. Until they do that, they cannot get out of square one...This is just a fact.....
It might well be a false doctrine. Or it might not be. All I am saying is that it is not necessarily a racist belief, nor is it necessarily a Christian belief, nor is it necessarily a replacement/supercessionist belief.
ReplyDeleteThat was my whole point.
As for your last quip. Good luck with that.
---
For the most part, tribal identities have been lost through the generations, and the majority of Jews do not know which tribe they are from.
There are a number of people whose families have passed down their identity as Kohanim (Priests) or Levites, which means they descend from the tribe of Levi. There are also a handful of non-Levite families who can trace their ancestry to a particular tribe, but these are few and far between.
When the Messiah comes, we will all find out which tribes we are from. So if this bit of information is important to you, do your best to hasten his arrival! For more on that, check out our Moshiach and the Future Redemption section.
http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/679454/jewish/How-Can-I-Find-Out-Which-Hebrew-Tribe-Im-From.htm
---
If world Jewry can't tell, for the most part, which tribe they came from (if one is a proponent of two house, that would be Benjamin, Judah, or Levi), how in the heck do you expect a people that lost their complete identity to know.
Illogical reasoning, at best.
"That was my whole point."
DeleteWell, you do not have a point, and you are wrong...As an Israeli Jew, when someone comes and tells me that he is entitled to 10/12 of my country, guess where I am going to send him/her?
"For the most part, tribal identities have been lost through the generations, and the majority of Jews do not know which tribe they are from."
They do, the Nazis knew...
"When the Messiah comes, we will all find out which tribes we are from. So if this bit of information is important to you, do your best to hasten his arrival! For more on that, check out our Moshiach and the Future Redemption section."
It is not important to me, But it seems it is important to you. You see, I am Jewish, don't need to go and prove my identity....
" If world Jewry can't tell, for the most part, which tribe they came from (if one is a proponent of two house, that would be Benjamin, Judah, or Levi), how in the heck do you expect a people that lost their complete identity to know."
I see that you already decided for me what tribe I am from...Very nice...I guess I cannot be from any other tribe but BenJamin, Judah, or Levy, so said Mr. King...
FYI, I am from the tribe of Asher, can you prove I am not?
Can you see how crazy is this FALSE doctrine?
A little story for you.
ReplyDeleteI work for a school district. There is a girl that just graduated this past May. Her mother is from Mexico and is a strict devout Catholic. Last year, she was given a family heirloom. It was a Star of David pendant. This girl was perplexed by it. Doing her own studying of the Bible since jr high, she has felt the urge to obey Torah. This gift was like a sign from God, but how was it a family heirloom? She is a Catholic! She got the answer last summer, while visiting her family down in Mexico. Come to find out, her family (both sides) were Jews who immigrated to Mexico a few hundred years ago. At the start of WW2, this girls grandparents were afraid of being persecuted, so they hid their identities. It was never spoken about, and the children (and grandchildren) were raised as Catholics. In just 1-2 generations, their Jewish identity was almost completely lost. It would have been, if not for this heirloom.
Now that is just ONE case. How many Conversos were there? How many people, throughout the centuries have hid their beliefs to avoid persecution, and have lost their identity within 70 years? Let that sink in for a bit.
This girl has an affinity for Torah, and by your standards, she would be a Gentile. But her family records show that she is actually a full blooded Jew. Explain to me exactly why she was looking into Torah, even before she knew any of this?
Furthermore, hers is not the only story like this. It is happening all over.
And now you have hundreds of thousands of random people just all of a sudden getting the seemingly random unction to observe Torah. People calling Jews their brothers. Willing to lay down their lives for their brothers and the land. Willing to leave everything they have behind and join their brother. And doing all of this knowing that not only will they be getting flack from a majority of Jews and Christians alike, and even worse from family and friends, but knowing that it is very possible, and very extremely likely that they will be persecuted and hunted to the death for standing with Jews, in what are the last days. And all these people are doing it for nefarious purposes? That is just absurd.
Who are you to say that these people are not being awoken by God? Who are you to say that these people are not part of the tribes? For all you know, they could be descendants of Conversos or Crypto-Jews, or they could very well be from any other tribe. Who knows? I sure as heck don't know. I am sure you do not either.
And yet here you are, along with the big organizations, with your fingers in your ears going lalalalalala-heretics-lalalalala. How does them claiming to be a lost tribe affect your worship of God? How does their calling to Torah obedience in love for Him affect your worship?
Again, this the perfect place for Gamliel:
"Refrain from these men, and let them alone! For if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought. But if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it, lest haply ye be found even to fight against God."
There was a great article put out by Mexico's Messianic Jewish community a few years back detailing the "fake Marranos" in Mexico claiming Jewish identity based on nothing more than some supposedly Jewish rituals that their othewise Catholic grandmother did (lighting up candles) or by claiming that they must be Jews if their surname ends with "ez" (i.e. Lopez). I'll try to look it up. In other words, Mexico has their own "Two-House movement" and the associated nuttiness.
DeleteAnd a little story for you....
DeleteIn a MJ congregation I led there were a few 2 housers. One day I gave a teaching and showed how bizarre is this doctrine. After the message an angry woman came to me, knowing I am from Israel she said: "well, when the Arabs are going to kill you all, then you will run to us for help..."
Yes, my friend, the 2 house/British Israel FALSE doctrine is RACIST, RACIST, RACIST...Look what happened to Armstrong church, it disintegrated... God dealt with them...And this is exactly what will happen to the 2-house...You do not mess with God....
--There was a great article put out by Mexico's Messianic Jewish community a few years back detailing the "fake Marranos" in Mexico claiming Jewish identity based on nothing more than some supposedly Jewish rituals that their othewise Catholic grandmother did (lighting up candles) or by claiming that they must be Jews if their surname ends with "ez" (i.e. Lopez). I'll try to look it up. In other words, Mexico has their own "Two-House movement" and the associated nuttiness.--
DeleteAnd you did it again. Is it possible at all for you not to broad-brush? Mormons believe that Yeshua preached in hell. Therefore anyone who believes in Yeshua believes He preached in hell and the associated nuttiness.
Thank you for admitting that the 2 house is nuttiness....You are a gentleman and a scholar.....
Delete--n a MJ congregation I led there were a few 2 housers. One day I gave a teaching and showed how bizarre is this doctrine. After the message an angry woman came to me, knowing I am from Israel she said: "well, when the Arabs are going to kill you all, then you will run to us for help..."--
DeleteSo a lady had issues with your teaching that she did not agree with and flew off the handle. Happens sometimes.
--Yes, my friend, the 2 house/British Israel FALSE doctrine is RACIST, RACIST, RACIST...Look what happened to Armstrong church, it disintegrated... God dealt with them...And this is exactly what will happen to the 2-house...You do not mess with God....---
See. That is part of the problem. YOu can't even see the difference between BI and Two House. Instead you lump them together because they have some things in common. Catholics pray to Mary, and so anyone who believes in Yeshua must also pray to Mary.
That is simply not logical.
"BI teaches that only Anglo-Saxon English peoples are Israel."
Please show me any one Messianic Two-House teacher that teaches this.
--Well, you do not have a point, and you are wrong...As an Israeli Jew, when someone comes and tells me that he is entitled to 10/12 of my country, guess where I am going to send him/her?--
ReplyDeleteActually, I do. It was in my original post. I said "the fact that two house is not necessarily bigoted, based in Christianity, or some form of replacement theology/supercessionism." And based on the evidence I have provided, it is not wrong, as you have done nothing to show me how these Orthodox Jews are bigoted Christians teaching replacement/supercessionist theology.
--They do, the Nazis knew...--
Really? Please show me where Nazi's targeted the 10 lost tribes.
--It is not important to me, But it seems it is important to you. You see, I am Jewish, don't need to go and prove my identity....--
As I have said multiple times. It is of no concern to me. I know who I am as well. I am a child of the living God, and that is all I need. What my concern is is that you all are painting a picture with a broad brush, based on a misconception.
--I see that you already decided for me what tribe I am from...Very nice...I guess I cannot be from any other tribe but BenJamin, Judah, or Levy, so said Mr. King...--
I did not. You are putting words in my mouth.
--FYI, I am from the tribe of Asher, can you prove I am not?--
No, and you can't prove you are either. Which is why the article said Messiah will tell everyone what tribe they are from.
--Can you see how crazy is this FALSE doctrine?--
Not in the least.
--Thank you for admitting that the 2 house is nuttiness....--
ReplyDeleteI did no such thing. Nice try though.
Have a great day, and may He overflow you with blessings.
For now, I am off to bed ;)
"Really? Please show me where Nazi's targeted the 10 lost tribes."
ReplyDeleteDo you want all 6 Million names, or the names of my family members will suffice?
"As I have said multiple times. It is of no concern to me. I know who I am as well. I am a child of the living God, and that is all I need. What my concern is is that you all are painting a picture with a broad brush, based on a misconception."
Until you and yours have been on the receiving end, you are not qualified to identify "Misconception..."
I am done....
--As an Israeli Jew, when someone comes and tells me that he is entitled to 10/12 of my country, guess where I am going to send him/her?--
ReplyDeleteEzekiel 47, friend. It is not up to you. It is what God says that matters.
And it shall come to pass, that ye shall divide it by lot for an inheritance unto you, and to the strangers that sojourn among you, which shall beget children among you: and they shall be unto you as born in the country among the children of Israel; they shall have inheritance with you among the tribes of Israel. And it shall come to pass, that in what tribe the stranger sojourneth, there shall ye give him his inheritance says the Lord God.
The only problem is that you are not a stranger, since you include yourself as Israel....Hope shooting yourself in the foot did not hurt too much...
DeleteNow, I am done....
Wow, what a great conversation but toward the end, emotions started taking over. Near the beginning the attitude was that we could all learn from each other.
ReplyDeleteI hold people like Greg Hershberg in high regard even though he does not believe in Two House. I do think that BI is wrong and "racist" but that word is overused a lot these days.
I do believe in two houses for the simple fact that today we live in the age of bible software and if you run some comparative searches on "House of Judah", "House of Israel (Joseph or Ephraim)", "scatter or scattered" "gather or regather" you will see an ENORMOUS amount of results both in the prophets and the NT.
I think its pointless trying to figure out what tribe you are from. I believe our brother Judah is still out there and retains his identity. Jacob said "The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, ...and unto him [shall] the gathering of the people be.
Its also fun to note that whenever the nation (people) of Israel moves in scripture, Judah always led the way first. Guess who is back in the land first?
Sure we disagree on much and that is okay. After all, when the world would rather sit around and discuss politics, sports, or the newest movie at the box office, folks like us are sitting around and discussing Torah and the prophets. There is nothing else I'd rather spend my time discussing, what about you?
I think much could be learned by all with a giant get-together to discuss such things knowing at the center we all have a love for the Father and His ways.
blessings!
-zac
http://www.New2Torah.com
Zac,
DeleteThanks for visiting and commenting!
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